Gay Marriage Ban Overturned by California’s Highest Court
In a 4 to 3 ruling, California’s highest court overturned the state’s ban on same-sex marriage today. This, despite voter’s not being in favor of same-sex marriage. Two dozen couples and gay rights groups petitioned lower courts, ending up at the highest court.
According to news reports, the cultural war is not over as other groups will seek to put measures on the ballots in November that will back current laws banning gay marriage by putting it the state’s constitution.
Interestingly, 6 of the 7 judges were appointed by Republican governors.
What is your opinion on the ruling?
Comments
I think the ruling is wonderful and long overdue. It's very interesting that the court consists of Republican appointed judges. The opinion is lengthy but here's an excerpt that sums it up:
After the ruling, Governor Schwarzenegger announced "...as I have said in the past, I will not support an amendment to the constitution that would overturn this state Supreme Court ruling."
A resounding victory!
The objections on religious grounds (and let's be honest, that's where most of the objections are coming from) are a red herring. There is no law that forces any religious body to perform a marriage of which they don't approve. If these couples want the same rights under civil law to form this particular legal contract as two people of the opposite sex, so what? Come to this city, and you don't have to travel 5 miles to find a preacher who won't perform interracial marriages and a rabbi who won't perform interfaith marriages, despite the legality of both. Civil law does not and can not define the religious institution of marriage. The two are distinct.
So in this decision, a group of people who had previously been denied the ability to enter into a civil contract on the basis of their gender and sexual orientation now have that right (at least for a while). Good for them.
Of course, this is Cali. Cue the first same-sex Hollywood marriage, and the associated betting pools on how long it lasts. Who's got dibs on Britney?
The man wanting to stop being called "gay" - well I agree. The word gay has been given a demeaning drop in character by attributing it to homosexuals. Homosexual is the correct word, lets use the correct word.
People in this country see fit to target gays, Mexicans, and Arabs right now. In a few decades, that will pass, and we'll be trying to legislate against some other group. As the writer of Ecclesiastes put it, "That which hath been is that which shall be, and that which hath been done is that which shall be done; and there is nothing new under the sun."
I,respectfully,disagree.
This is not a matter of"targeting"as much as it is identifying the enemies
of the Republic that Us American citizens hold dear.
"In a few decades that will pass"?
What the F*** is that supposed to mean?That those of Us Americans
that still believe in the soveriegnty of Our country will be relics in a few
decades?
I got news for Ya,Sister,over My dead body.And if You wish Me
dead than You are no better than the rest of those who plot the
downfall of the United States.
I'll fight to save Your butt,but only God can save your soul.
"He who stands for nothing,will fall for anything"
"Marriage"is a sacred pact between a Man and a Woman,concieved
by the mind of Mankind for the purposes of procreation.For too long
have the hollywierd pinkos made an abomination of this,and You may
be in california,but you certainly have not the approval of the other 49
states,excepting massachusetts,and considering that they are willing
to continue to vote the murdering kennedy into office,they are equal
as far as lack of brains are concerned.
You say We "target"mexicans and arabs?And who,pray tell,is their "target"?
You got it,sister,every single working-class American that has a job
that can legally(?) be stolen,and the land that the sand-born arabs covet.
Ya think the present war is a bad thing?Wait till someone like Obunger
decides to cut out parts of the Constitution they don't like.
The President is sworn to uphold and protect the Constitution,not
dictate it's meaning from the eyes of the UN.
To say nothing of those of Us who are out of work because of the
supposedly unstoppable attack of illegals on Our jobs.
Go ahead,vote for queer marriages,vote for amnesty,vote for islamic
rule over Our schools,a few decades from now,I won't be around
to see the degrading rape of America,I'll have died in the revolution.
Hopefully,America will once again Win over Her oppressors.
Humbled:
People Like Us are all that is left of Our beloved Nation,May God
at least Bless Us with a noble death,and that the sacrifice of Our
lives be remembered in History as the last great stand for Freedom.
Blockhead
The only state allowing gay marriage is Massachusetts, yes?
However, I've read that while the majority of the state of California does not entertain the notion of gays getting married, they do have the best laws and privileges in terms of civil unions in comparison to any other state, correct?
Sheri,
Obviously a traitor and infiltrator,to be terminated on sight,
with extreme prejudice.If Ya decide to come for Me,I live
in Florida,and I suggest You come armed.And may God
have mercy on Your soul,for I will have none.
Blockhead
"Smile,Motherfucker,You're about to meet Allah"!!!!
All you queers are in the same class as illegal mexicans !!
Joe,
I wonder if that's really "Madonna" or someone using Her name.
I wouldn't be surprised either way,but note the picture at the
top of this post.
"100% straight,but married to a Man".That just goes to show how
if Ya give an inch,nuts,(such as the californians,the land of fruits and nuts)
will find a way to abuse any new law that is passed.Next,We'll have
roommates,straight ones,that can't settle down with a woman,filing
for tax breaks masquerading as a gay couple.It's kinda like the illegals,
there will be no end in sight 'till the American people put their foot down.
And as far as "sheri",the critter that posted a response to Me that I
couldn't read,hey,I guess there is some kind of nobility I don't know
about in hiding behind a foreign language,seems like it's first post was
in english,LOLOLOL,that's the enemy for Ya,hide like roaches,fight
like cowards.We will prevail,although it may not be in My lifetime.
GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!
So why would I post in Hebrew, and not English? First, because that is the language of the scripture.
You assume because I believe in treating others as I myself would like to be treated were I in there shoes, that I am secular. What a sad thing that is.
These words are from the Bible. Look them up if you want to know what they say. These are the scriptures read by a Jew - Yeshua bar Yosef - the man you call Jesus. They were hardly foreign to him. It is sad that they are foreign to you, one who claims to be his folower.
And what was that guy like, exactly? Well, he was just a liberal Jew who hung out with a bunch of sinners. Sinners - those people you look forward to killing in a revolution - these were his company. And it is in the name of this man that you wish to kill and be killed? And of the God who gave us all life, you ask only that He give you death? This is your religion? Murder?
I previously quoted the words of the Torah, but now I will leave with the words of another Jew, Albert Einstein:
"But why so many words when I can say it in one sentenced, and in a sentence very appropriate for a Jew: Honor your Master Jesus Christ not only in words and songs, but rather foremost by your deeds."
First of all,if the line You posted was hebrew,translate it exactly.
And second of all,You seem to hide behind the Jewish faith
as if it were without reproach,but the story of Moses,Joshua,
Gideon,etc.is a literal bloodbath of violence and ingenious military
strategy in the taking of the land of canaan.
Jesus came much later,and was betrayed by the Jews,who to this
day believe that the Messiah has yet to come .
In the Christian faith,most of Us call it ''the second coming"and if it happens
in My lifetime,I will go where the Good Lord Sends Me.I don't necessarily
think that being a "Christian"is about how hard one thumps His/Her Bible,
but how one gives back to mankind that which is given.
Not "good works",but a lifestyle,where one does the Best they can to
help others,and do little harm.I answer only to the Saviour,and no other.
But,in the event that some faction such as radical islam wishes to dominate
Us,as if the illegals weren't enough,I stand ready to fight to the last,
and will let St.Peter judge Me as He will.
Yep, it's the "I'm great and your not" syndrome. I tell you, the self esteem indoctrination needs to stop. People are thinking to highly of themselves...they are in hyper-self esteem and it just exposes their extreme stupidity and a self-centeredness in their world view.
This person is just another puppet parroting their call for tolerance but yet is intolerant and will demonize anyone who disagree with them. Lets call those what they are....HYPOCRITE!!!
BTW: Proposition 22, which strengthened the California's 1978 one-man, one-woman marriage law with the words "Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California," passed with 61 percent of the vote.
What happened to democracy and the "people's voice"?
I will not share my views on the post that originated the comments. Because it doesn't matter what I say. It's an opinion. If you're upset, then contact your Senator, Representative, etc. Be an activist. Discourse is great if action is behind it. Otherwise, wind bagging - of which I am often guilty. Often.
I will say, that I am appalled by the hate filled, violence threatening comments directed to people whom I'm sure Jim invited to comment who have been respectful at the outset of sharing their opinions.
And then they were sent threatening posts. What gives? Go ahead, hate the issue discussed, i.e., gay marriages, fine, but to bash people who share their views who have been asked to be here and to write threats of harm and violence is something I just don't understand.
How did we get into anti-American rhetoric? What am I missing? You think that the Constitution has been compromised? Didn't the governor say he'd go with the Supreme Court? And isn't that part of the constitutional process? Am I missing something? Jim, I understand your comment - what about the people's votes. Sometimes I just don't get our government process and feel our freedoms are being chipped away. We vote, but we get delegates who can change their minds and vote for someone else. The electoral college disregards the popular vote.. Laws are made and the Supreme Court can vote and things change good or bad. The people can vote, but if the Senate/House vote differently, too bad. Is this country really free anymore? The government blacks out what the press has access to. The Patriot Act is great for protection, but don't be so sure as has happened in history, it isn't currently being used on the average American. So Jim, the people's vote? Good question.
Am I a proud American? Yes. Do I support violent, demeaning verbal attacks in the name of God and Country on blogs, no. Hate damages your cause. But if I say that, I am sure I will hear I'm anti-American, anti-Christian, liberal, commie. None of which is true, but it is a way for people to satisfy their anger. Name calling and threats. What's the point of Jim or anyone asking questions for debate, he's inviting debate, if the forum is turned into a fight.
What I've read here are anti-semitic comments, gay hate comments, and just plan rudeness.
I found it very true and very interesting point someone made. Jesus hung out with sinners. He was pure, sinless and a role model that changed life forever and sinners changed on the spot. Isn't that what we're supposed to do? Be role models?
If you're for the greater good of this country and of your faith, then could you elevate the level of dialogue? Just try to keep the machine guns pointed to the ground when you respond. :) And please, if you choose to respond, then do so respectfully. I respect and applaud your love of God and Country. I'm on your side on that.
But I don't support bigotry. Sorry.
They are suppose to be about "in their opinions" - that means giving their opinions - not making laws.
What does our founders say about the judiciaries role? Well here are some of their words:
_______________________________________________
Here are some more quotes from great men who had words about the judiciary:
We'll see who's really about loving the true morals and ideas the United States is built upon or who is only in this for game of changing our nation into a sewer for selfish gain.
The Judiciary Department
From McLEAN'S Edition, New York.
Author: Alexander Hamilton
To the People of the State of New York:
WE PROCEED now to an examination of the judiciary department of the proposed government.
In unfolding the defects of the existing Confederation, the utility and necessity of a federal judicature have been clearly pointed out. It is the less necessary to recapitulate the considerations there urged, as the propriety of the institution in the abstract is not disputed; the only questions which have been raised being relative to the manner of constituting it, and to its extent. To these points, therefore, our observations shall be confined.
The manner of constituting it seems to embrace these several objects: 1st. The mode of appointing the judges. 2d. The tenure by which they are to hold their places. 3d. The partition of the judiciary authority between different courts, and their relations to each other.
First. As to the mode of appointing the judges; this is the same with that of appointing the officers of the Union in general, and has been so fully discussed in the two last numbers, that nothing can be said here which would not be useless repetition.
Second. As to the tenure by which the judges are to hold their places; this chiefly concerns their duration in office; the provisions for their support; the precautions for their responsibility.
According to the plan of the convention, all judges who may be appointed by the United States are to hold their offices DURING GOOD BEHAVIOR; which is conformable to the most approved of the State constitutions and among the rest, to that of this State. Its propriety having been drawn into question by the adversaries of that plan, is no light symptom of the rage for objection, which disorders their imaginations and judgments. The standard of good behavior for the continuance in office of the judicial magistracy, is certainly one of the most valuable of the modern improvements in the practice of government. In a monarchy it is an excellent barrier to the despotism of the prince; in a republic it is a no less excellent barrier to the encroachments and oppressions of the representative body. And it is the best expedient which can be devised in any government, to secure a steady, upright, and impartial administration of the laws.
Whoever attentively considers the different departments of power must perceive, that, in a government in which they are separated from each other, the judiciary, from the nature of its functions, will always be the least dangerous to the political rights of the Constitution; because it will be least in a capacity to annoy or injure them. The Executive not only dispenses the honors, but holds the sword of the community. The legislature not only commands the purse, but prescribes the rules by which the duties and rights of every citizen are to be regulated. The judiciary, on the contrary, has no influence over either the sword or the purse; no direction either of the strength or of the wealth of the society; and can take no active resolution whatever. It may truly be said to have neither FORCE nor WILL, but merely judgment; and must ultimately depend upon the aid of the executive arm even for the efficacy of its judgments.
This simple view of the matter suggests several important consequences. It proves incontestably, that the judiciary is beyond comparison the weakest of the three departments of power [1] ; that it can never attack with success either of the other two; and that all possible care is requisite to enable it to defend itself against their attacks. It equally proves, that though individual oppression may now and then proceed from the courts of justice, the general liberty of the people can never be endangered from that quarter; I mean so long as the judiciary remains truly distinct from both the legislature and the Executive. For I agree, that ``there is no liberty, if the power of judging be not separated from the legislative and executive powers.'' [2] And it proves, in the last place, that as liberty can have nothing to fear from the judiciary alone, but would have every thing to fear from its union with either of the other departments; that as all the effects of such a union must ensue from a dependence of the former on the latter, notwithstanding a nominal and apparent separation; that as, from the natural feebleness of the judiciary, it is in continual jeopardy of being overpowered, awed, or influenced by its co-ordinate branches; and that as nothing can contribute so much to its firmness and independence as permanency in office, this quality may therefore be justly regarded as an indispensable ingredient in its constitution, and, in a great measure, as the citadel of the public justice and the public security.
The complete independence of the courts of justice is peculiarly essential in a limited Constitution. By a limited Constitution, I understand one which contains certain specified exceptions to the legislative authority; such, for instance, as that it shall pass no bills of attainder, no ex-post-facto laws, and the like. Limitations of this kind can be preserved in practice no other way than through the medium of courts of justice, whose duty it must be to declare all acts contrary to the manifest tenor of the Constitution void. Without this, all the reservations of particular rights or privileges would amount to nothing.
Some perplexity respecting the rights of the courts to pronounce legislative acts void, because contrary to the Constitution, has arisen from an imagination that the doctrine would imply a superiority of the judiciary to the legislative power. It is urged that the authority which can declare the acts of another void, must necessarily be superior to the one whose acts may be declared void. As this doctrine is of great importance in all the American constitutions, a brief discussion of the ground on which it rests cannot be unacceptable.
There is no position which depends on clearer principles, than that every act of a delegated authority, contrary to the tenor of the commission under which it is exercised, is void. No legislative act, therefore, contrary to the Constitution, can be valid. To deny this, would be to affirm, that the deputy is greater than his principal; that the servant is above his master; that the representatives of the people are superior to the people themselves; that men acting by virtue of powers, may do not only what their powers do not authorize, but what they forbid.
If it be said that the legislative body are themselves the constitutional judges of their own powers, and that the construction they put upon them is conclusive upon the other departments, it may be answered, that this cannot be the natural presumption, where it is not to be collected from any particular provisions in the Constitution. It is not otherwise to be supposed, that the Constitution could intend to enable the representatives of the people to substitute their WILL to that of their constituents. It is far more rational to suppose, that the courts were designed to be an intermediate body between the people and the legislature, in order, among other things, to keep the latter within the limits assigned to their authority. The interpretation of the laws is the proper and peculiar province of the courts. A constitution is, in fact, and must be regarded by the judges, as a fundamental law. It therefore belongs to them to ascertain its meaning, as well as the meaning of any particular act proceeding from the legislative body. If there should happen to be an irreconcilable variance between the two, that which has the superior obligation and validity ought, of course, to be preferred; or, in other words, the Constitution ought to be preferred to the statute, the intention of the people to the intention of their agents.
Nor does this conclusion by any means suppose a superiority of the judicial to the legislative power. It only supposes that the power of the people is superior to both; and that where the will of the legislature, declared in its statutes, stands in opposition to that of the people, declared in the Constitution, the judges ought to be governed by the latter rather than the former. They ought to regulate their decisions by the fundamental laws, rather than by those which are not fundamental.
This exercise of judicial discretion, in determining between two contradictory laws, is exemplified in a familiar instance. It not uncommonly happens, that there are two statutes existing at one time, clashing in whole or in part with each other, and neither of them containing any repealing clause or expression. In such a case, it is the province of the courts to liquidate and fix their meaning and operation. So far as they can, by any fair construction, be reconciled to each other, reason and law conspire to dictate that this should be done; where this is impracticable, it becomes a matter of necessity to give effect to one, in exclusion of the other. The rule which has obtained in the courts for determining their relative validity is, that the last in order of time shall be preferred to the first. But this is a mere rule of construction, not derived from any positive law, but from the nature and reason of the thing. It is a rule not enjoined upon the courts by legislative provision, but adopted by themselves, as consonant to truth and propriety, for the direction of their conduct as interpreters of the law. They thought it reasonable, that between the interfering acts of an EQUAL authority, that which was the last indication of its will should have the preference.
But in regard to the interfering acts of a superior and subordinate authority, of an original and derivative power, the nature and reason of the thing indicate the converse of that rule as proper to be followed. They teach us that the prior act of a superior ought to be preferred to the subsequent act of an inferior and subordinate authority; and that accordingly, whenever a particular statute contravenes the Constitution, it will be the duty of the judicial tribunals to adhere to the latter and disregard the former.
It can be of no weight to say that the courts, on the pretense of a repugnancy, may substitute their own pleasure to the constitutional intentions of the legislature. This might as well happen in the case of two contradictory statutes; or it might as well happen in every adjudication upon any single statute. The courts must declare the sense of the law; and if they should be disposed to exercise WILL instead of JUDGMENT, the consequence would equally be the substitution of their pleasure to that of the legislative body. The observation, if it prove any thing, would prove that there ought to be no judges distinct from that body.
If, then, the courts of justice are to be considered as the bulwarks of a limited Constitution against legislative encroachments, this consideration will afford a strong argument for the permanent tenure of judicial offices, since nothing will contribute so much as this to that independent spirit in the judges which must be essential to the faithful performance of so arduous a duty.
This independence of the judges is equally requisite to guard the Constitution and the rights of individuals from the effects of those ill humors, which the arts of designing men, or the influence of particular conjunctures, sometimes disseminate among the people themselves, and which, though they speedily give place to better information, and more deliberate reflection, have a tendency, in the meantime, to occasion dangerous innovations in the government, and serious oppressions of the minor party in the community. Though I trust the friends of the proposed Constitution will never concur with its enemies, [3] in questioning that fundamental principle of republican government, which admits the right of the people to alter or abolish the established Constitution, whenever they find it inconsistent with their happiness, yet it is not to be inferred from this principle, that the representatives of the people, whenever a momentary inclination happens to lay hold of a majority of their constituents, incompatible with the provisions in the existing Constitution, would, on that account, be justifiable in a violation of those provisions; or that the courts would be under a greater obligation to connive at infractions in this shape, than when they had proceeded wholly from the cabals of the representative body. Until the people have, by some solemn and authoritative act, annulled or changed the established form, it is binding upon themselves collectively, as well as individually; and no presumption, or even knowledge, of their sentiments, can warrant their representatives in a departure from it, prior to such an act. But it is easy to see, that it would require an uncommon portion of fortitude in the judges to do their duty as faithful guardians of the Constitution, where legislative invasions of it had been instigated by the major voice of the community.
But it is not with a view to infractions of the Constitution only, that the independence of the judges may be an essential safeguard against the effects of occasional ill humors in the society. These sometimes extend no farther than to the injury of the private rights of particular classes of citizens, by unjust and partial laws. Here also the firmness of the judicial magistracy is of vast importance in mitigating the severity and confining the operation of such laws. It not only serves to moderate the immediate mischiefs of those which may have been passed, but it operates as a check upon the legislative body in passing them; who, perceiving that obstacles to the success of iniquitous intention are to be expected from the scruples of the courts, are in a manner compelled, by the very motives of the injustice they meditate, to qualify their attempts. This is a circumstance calculated to have more influence upon the character of our governments, than but few may be aware of. The benefits of the integrity and moderation of the judiciary have already been felt in more States than one; and though they may have displeased those whose sinister expectations they may have disappointed, they must have commanded the esteem and applause of all the virtuous and disinterested. Considerate men, of every description, ought to prize whatever will tend to beget or fortify that temper in the courts: as no man can be sure that he may not be to-morrow the victim of a spirit of injustice, by which he may be a gainer to-day. And every man must now feel, that the inevitable tendency of such a spirit is to sap the foundations of public and private confidence, and to introduce in its stead universal distrust and distress.
That inflexible and uniform adherence to the rights of the Constitution, and of individuals, which we perceive to be indispensable in the courts of justice, can certainly not be expected from judges who hold their offices by a temporary commission. Periodical appointments, however regulated, or by whomsoever made, would, in some way or other, be fatal to their necessary independence. If the power of making them was committed either to the Executive or legislature, there would be danger of an improper complaisance to the branch which possessed it; if to both, there would be an unwillingness to hazard the displeasure of either; if to the people, or to persons chosen by them for the special purpose, there would be too great a disposition to consult popularity, to justify a reliance that nothing would be consulted but the Constitution and the laws.
There is yet a further and a weightier reason for the permanency of the judicial offices, which is deducible from the nature of the qualifications they require. It has been frequently remarked, with great propriety, that a voluminous code of laws is one of the inconveniences necessarily connected with the advantages of a free government. To avoid an arbitrary discretion in the courts, it is indispensable that they should be bound down by strict rules and precedents, which serve to define and point out their duty in every particular case that comes before them; and it will readily be conceived from the variety of controversies which grow out of the folly and wickedness of mankind, that the records of those precedents must unavoidably swell to a very considerable bulk, and must demand long and laborious study to acquire a competent knowledge of them. Hence it is, that there can be but few men in the society who will have sufficient skill in